Mon, 2020-11-30 19:16
Who do you think would win Whyte vs. Joyce?
Tue, 2020-12-01 03:21
Joyce by UD, I think the jab to the head and body would knock a lot out of Whyte, and his own jab would be ineffective, I think Joyce could take Whyte's power, it would be interesting to see Whyte land the left hook, that one could hurt him, but I don't think Whyte could build on it much, I think Whyte would be less uncomfortable under the pressure than Dubois, would be mentally more prepared, and it would be harder for Joyce to use the clinches given how effective Whyte's dirty fighting is, but Whyte doesn't have the speed of Dubois, wouldn't be able to spurts of success Dubois had by quickening the feet and throwing a combination.
What do you think?
Tue, 2020-12-01 17:28
I think it is a competitive and interesting fight. I think the opposition of Dubois made him look better than he was in hindsight and Joyce looked easy to counter versus Jennings. I think Whyte can have success and could win but the later the fight goes the worse chance Whyte has, I don't know how Joyce would hold up if Whyte lands his best shot clean but as we've said Whyte isn't the best finisher and if he gassed trying to finish he'd probably get stopped. I think if Joyce can start out strong and build up points boxing with his jab, it's going to be very tough for Whyte, he definitely can't keep the pace Joyce can. I wouldn't be super worried about Joyce on the inside with Whyte, I think Joyce would be quite a bit stronger than Whyte. I think Joyce close points is the most likely result but he could get in trouble. I could see any result happening in the fight which is why I think it's interesting and not impossible to happen if the right things happen politically.
Wed, 2020-12-02 04:48
I don't know if I agree it made him look better in terms of his potential, but in terms of the here and now, I agree, it made him look more ready than he was. I think Jennings fight was what Joyce needed, it was the only good learning fight between the 2. I agree, Joyce would make Whyte work harder, and Whyte doesn't live the life, which costs him stamina. Joyce has a granite chin, no doubt about that, but he doesn't fight with his face, he pulls back and adjusts his position as punches come, I think Whyte would struggle to land his left hook. I agree he's a fair bit stronger, but it's Whyte's ability to be effectice with dirty fighting he can get away with, and knowing how to get away with it is a skill. I'd be surprised if it happened, I don't think Whyte would want to fight Joyce, unless of course it directly leads to a world title fight. I expect the Povetkin rematch to be confirmed for January or February at the latest.
Wed, 2020-12-02 08:31
Yeah that's what I mean, it made him look better in terms of how good he was at the moment. I think it was a good learning fight as well but it showed Joyce can be countered which gives Whyte a good chance. Do you think he has a granite chin? It was some time ago but we know Kuzmin KOd him in the amateurs, it's possible Dubois wasn't the puncher he thought he was, especially after he gassed. I think it could happen if it ended up being for a title eliminator or title situation and is more likely if Joyce signs with Matchroom. I agree Whyte probably wouldn't want Joyce unless it was worth his while in that way, seems like higher risk and low reward.
I haven't checked but are you still picking Garcia over Spence? I'll be putting in my PCOM picks soon.
Wed, 2020-12-02 12:04
I just realised I haven't added my analysis for this fight to my post, I'll do that shortly, I think you'll agree with most of it if you read it, especially my take on the quitting situation.
I think Whyte could give Joyce problems whenever he could push him back, I don't think Joyce deals well with being backed up, he can be countered, and I think he struggles with combinations as well, Whyte is good enough in both those aspects to trouble Joyce, but not enough to beat him in my opinion, and Joyce is likely stronger than Whyte. He's known for his chin, and the Dubois fight backed that up, I know he was stopped by Kuzmin, and I haven't seen that fight, but it wouldn't surprise me if it was a case of his defence being non-existent, nd it being a fight that wouldn't have been stopped in the professionals. It's highly likely he'll sign with Mushroom, Warren doesn't seem to want to promote him, and it makes sense for Joyce in terms of where the opponents are, but I wonder what fights make the most sense for him before he gets his shot, Usyk is ahead of him, so if we get Joshua vs Fury in the first half of next year, Joyce will have to wait until 2022, his best hope would be the Usyk fight but there's very little in that for Usyk, who do you think Joyce could fight if not Whyte?
I'm still thinking about it, I'll let you know, but I definitely think Spence won't be the same, I think a lot of his attributes will still be there, but not his resistance, reflexes, timing. Based on a PBC interview with Derrick James, it seems like Spence has been training longer than he ever has, that will help his durability, but even if his legs can keep him up, and he has the athleticism to keep moving after being hurt, I wonder if his brain will react badly whenever he gets hit, it might be similar to Joshua against Ruiz the first time, he was able to move around the ring in rounds 5 and 6, but whenever he took a head shot, he was in a bad way. What after affects from the accident do you expect?
Wed, 2020-12-02 13:39
Not to interject, but if Joyce was to sign with Matchroom, I could see a Hrgovic in his future. Don’t think Whyte would take it outside the circumstances you two cited, and don’t think AJ would be in line. Would be fairly thin outside those 2 or Usyk, so it’s one I could see.
Wed, 2020-12-02 14:33
Ingerject all you want pal, the more the merrier! I just realised I put Mushroom instead of Matchroom!
I could see the Hrgovic fight happening, the Yoka fight is another one, it's obviously not as easy to make with it not being in house, but Bakole is another possible opponent.
Wed, 2020-12-02 14:45
As Champ said definitely interject any time you want. Bakole would be an interesting fight, I'm looking forward to Bakole vs. Kuzmin.
Thu, 2020-12-03 16:15
Added some fights to the vault given so many are being cancelled.
Sergio Martinez vs Jussi Koivula
Kazuto Ioka vs Kosei Tanaka
Ali Alhmedov vs Carlos Gongora
Wed, 2020-12-02 14:44
If Whyte could back Joyce up I don't think he would be able to do it consistently because of Joyce's jab, size, and his movement is better than Whyte's. He actually was legitimately stopped in that fight versus Kuzmin, he ended up dropped if I remember correctly rather than stopped standing, but that was a long time ago. I wonder if Joyce signs with the right promoter/makes the right political moves if it could be Usyk vs. Joyce for the vacant WBO given that even if Joshua vs. Fury is signed, it will likely be a trilogy. I think who Joyce could fight really depends on who is promoting him, if he re-signed with Warren he would basically have to try to target the vacant WBO. If he signed with Matchroom or even Top Rank he would have more options. I think what Salt is saying about Joyce vs. Hrgovic would be interesting, two guys who are seen as higher risk and low reward.
I haven't seen it and won't put a bunch of stock in it but I heard Spence looked good at an open workout this last weekend. I can't really speculate on what the effects will be but I assume he will be easier to cut and may have decreased punch resistance as you mentioned.
Thu, 2020-12-03 04:37
Good point, I think Joyce's feet are slower than Whyte's, but because he's better schooled, he uses his feet to position his shots. That would make no sense for Usyk if Joshua or Fury has the belt, but if it's for the vacant title, I could definitely see that fight happening. Trilogy? Do you mean they'd both get a rematch clause and if they lost a rematch? I've never known a trilogy clause, and I personally think it would be 2-0 to Fury. It makes no sense for him to re-sign with Warren in my opinion, I don't think Warren has done a good job of promotong him, his opposition has been poor overall given his age and amateur background, I think it's similar to the situation with Crawford and Arum.
All we can do is speculate because there's only so often a fighter comes back from a car accident, and obviously different accidents do different damage, but I think we can expect his reflexes and timing to not be as good as before. I think I'll predict Garcia by UD, tough call because the implications of the accident are so unpredictable, but I think Garcia.
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