Michael Hunter vs Fabio Maldonado Scorecard by Gold

scorecard by GOLD



Michael Hunter

Fabio Maldonado

We do need help growing, please share:


Gold's picture

Hahaha DAZN commentary implying Hunter could beat Tyson Fury

petieroach's picture

How was Fabio good enough to go the distance with Rivas?? This guy looked like straight trash tonight

Gold's picture

Rivas is probably overrated at the moment, but I agree it is strange he went ten with Rivas and Teslenko yet looked like a bum in this fight. If I didn't have to watch twenty rounds of Fabio Maldonado box I would watch the fights to find out, but that's too much of an ask for me personally.

Champion97's picture

Same here, we don't have to analyse it, but Hunter did well to stop in 2, looked solid, especially given the weight. Rivas is either overrated or a fighter who does better with a challenge, we'll find out when he fights Whyte.

Champion97's picture

1. Gold, NF82. 57
2. Champion97. 56
3. goosu. 54
4. Champion58, TheIceManJDog. 51
5. SalTnutZ1. 50
6. Floyd tough competitor mayweather, JML14. 48
7. PhillyPhan69. 41
8. mike25. 40
9. petieroach. 35

Gold and NF82 win May.

Congratulations my friend

Gold's picture

Thank you, it has been a long time since I last won lol

Champion97's picture

Same here, I came second this month, but I just fell short by a point. Hopefully at some point, we can get medals on our profile pages for months won.

Gold's picture

You would have won if Gausha got the decision right? That's tough luck

Champion97's picture

Yeah, I got 2 points because I called the split decision, but I would have got 4 points and won if Gausha had got a UD like he apparently should have done, I saw you had it wide for Gausha, a lot of people are saying he got robbed. To be fair, if you had stuck with what seemed like a big swing, hadn't gone with Ito, you would have won on your own, won by a fair few points.

Gold's picture

Yeah, I just wanted to play it safe. I just hope Top Rank makes Berchelt vs. Herring next instead of having a home defense/tune up for Herring next. The Trout vs. Gausha fight wasn't very entertaining, it was a tactical bout like you'd expect between those two guys. Gausha was winning rounds pretty clearly in my opinion and should have got the decision. Trout should retire in my opinion, he's not totally washed but he's clearly declined from where he was versus Jermall Charlo or even Hurd. I was hoping for a decisive winner of that fight so they could fight Lubin, but Lubin vs. Gausha wouldn't be bad.

Champion97's picture

Trout is declining, he has never been able to repeat his performances against Cotto and Canelo, he was very good at that point, but he did do very well against the Charlos and I think Hurd, but he is well past his best now, might not be done boxing, but is done at world level. I still believe Trout had a bad night against Lara, was better against Charlo and Hurd, but whether that's true or not, Trout's absolute best was in 2012-13, that's a long time ago, I don't think Gausha is good enough to beat a prime Trout, but I thought the timing was enough for him to win.

How do rate Mayweather Sr as a trainer? Trout was working with him for this fight, we didn't get to see Tete fight with him in his corner

Gold's picture

Yeah, it was more or less about timing. I think most people including myself who thought Trout would win thought he had enough left to overcome the age and miles but he didn't.

He's a decent trainer, but I can't remember him having a boxer I thought improved significantly under him. For someone like Trout that is older, it seems to be best to have a trainer like McGirt that will make sure they aren't over or under trained and fight to their advantages. I didn't think Mayweather Sr was going to have a notable positive or negative impact on Trout given his age. Trout is what he is. Tete would be a good case for Mayweather Sr to show he can improve a fighter given Tete looked very poor versus Aloyan and put in a mediocre performance versus Narvaez. If Mayweather Sr can get him to use his advantages that would be good for his reputation as a trainer.

Champion97's picture

I think Sr has as much boxing knowledge as you can have, but being a good trainer isn't just about that, and I don't think he is a top trainer. I think BoMac is a great trainer, I don't think I've ever seen Crawford doing the wrong things.

Judah vs Seldin is an interesting fight, because we know Judah is a level above Seldin, would have beat him easy in his prime, but he is very old, has not been active at all, should be a good fight.

Gold's picture

I agree, in all aspects of life it is important to note that someone having a mastery of a skill doesn't necessarily mean they are great teachers and/or can effectively convey the knowledge they have. BoMac was a 7-14 journeyman as a pro and developed Crawford which is very impressive. BoMac also trained Jamel Herring to a title upset this weekend. Considering Herring wasn't considered a title threat at all after taking his second loss, that is an impressive addition to BoMac's resume as a trainer.

Judah vs. Seldin is a sort of morbid curiosity for me. It has very little impact on boxing but it should be interesting for the reasons you said. It is hard to pick a winner, there are so many unknowns about the fight, some of which you mentioned. I assume the fight will be streamed in some way, but I don't know that for sure.

Champion97's picture

I didn't even know he'd fought. Didn't know that either, would have given Herring more of a shot if I'd known that, but I still wouldn't have said he'd beat Ito. Great trainer Bo Mac, doesn't get enough credit. I think Derrick James is a great trainer, Spence backs that up, I would have said Jermell Charlo, but his tactics aren't always right, but I think that is more about him not doing what his trainer tells him.

Not a world level fight, but it will be an interesting, entertaining fight. We'll be able to watch the fight somehow, it won't be on live TV over here, I know that much, it's not a big fight, but I'm talking about the entertainment aspect, and also the interesting case of a fighter who is well past his best fighting an opponent who is a level below him but has time on his side. The gap isn't as much, but Thurman vs Pacquiao is similar, Thurman isn't as good as Pacquiao, but he might be good enough to beat Pacquiao now.

Gold's picture

Yeah, Derrick James is a great trainer, and I agree that I don't know if I would put too much blame on him for Charlo's poor tactics versus Harrison. The trainer can have the right plan made but the fighter may not follow it or can't follow it. It seems like Jermell is a hotheaded guy who fell too much in love with his power so he tried to take Harrison's head off instead of boxing him. Harrison was also likely underrated going into that fight. I think Charlo will win the rematch because he'll box more to his strengths, but it will be competitive. What do you think?

Pacquiao vs. Thurman is another hard fight to predict, but age is undefeated. If Pacquiao wins it will be up there with efforts such as Duran vs. Barkley, Hopkins vs. Pascal/Cloud, Foreman vs. Moorer, etc. Have you seen the Pacquiao vs. Thurman undercard? It is very good, apparently, it will be Yordenis Ugas vs. Omar Figueroa, Sergey Lipinets vs. John Molina Jr, and Luis Nery vs. possibly Rau'shee Warren or Juan Carlos Payano with Caleb Plant vs. Mike Lee as a free TV lead-in.

Champion97's picture

I think Charlo will knock him out this time, I think he might be behind, will definitely struggle with Harrison's movement, but I think he will win the same way he knocked out Lubin, not by going after the other guy and going for the KO when it isn't being set up, but by waiting for the opening, letting his opponent make the mistake, and getting the KO with power but also timing and accuracy. We can't know whether Charlo will be smart this time, I'm just giving him the benefit of the doubt, but if he repeats what he did the first time, getting obsessed with the KO, I think Harrison will make it 2-0.

I think Harrison is underrated, like Williams, I think Hurd and Charlo were bad on the night, especially Hurd, but it is also about the underdog being underrated. I think champions going from Hunter to hunted happens a lot in boxing, more than people realise.

I know man, it's the best card of the year, I was just saying that, I didn't know about Nery vs Warren or Payano, but the other undercard fights are great.

Gold's picture

If Charlo boxes more intelligently he can make it harder for Harrison to conserve his energy and steal rounds as he did in the first fight which can set up the KO as you said. However, if it goes to the cards the fight is in Las Vegas which makes me think Charlo will be getting the benefit of the doubt if it is a very close fight again.

I personally didn't see Hurd being bad versus Williams, but Williams exposing a lot of the potential downfalls in Hurd's game that were shown in previous fights versus Harrison, Trout, Lara, and even Welborn. Hurd is limited boxing in the center of the ring where Williams outboxed him, and when they got on the ropes Williams where Hurd usually has his success he was outskilled. Sometimes a challenger just has a champions number, with enough quality challengers of different styles one is bound to upset the champion. Harrison, Trout, Lara, and Williams in five fights is a tough schedule.

Champion97's picture

I did, I agree he has faults and has always been clearly beatable, but I think he would have beaten Williams had he done what he did against Lara and Trout, he looked drained to me, but I also think once he beat Lara, he thought Williams would be easier, didn't mentally prepare as well, still, Williams fought a great fight, still beat Hurd and beat him clearly.

That's a good point about it being a tough schedule, there is a reason why a lot of fighters have one fairly easy fight a year and one meaningful fight rather than two, James DeGale, between Periban (late 2014), and the guy he beat after Truax (mid or late 2018), he had nothing but tough, wear and tear fights, Dirrell, Bute, Medina, Jack, Truax twice, 6 damaging fights in a row which were all at least fairly entertaining fights, lost an unlikely minimum of 3 rounds in all of them, took a bad beating against Jack and Truax, especially Jack, and a certain amount of miles seemed to age him because he took all that damage, crammed into 4 tough years, which isn't the same as taking that damage over more time, still, I don't think the damage Hurd took against Harrison, Trout, Lara, jas caught up to him yet, and I thought his performance against Williams was very poor, a rematch would be interesting, but if I were Hurd, I'd go to 160

Gold's picture

What did he do against Lara and Trout in your opinion that he didn't do versus Williams? He didn't look drawn to me at the weigh-ins, but it is hard to tell things like that. I do think it being in Hurd's hometown was a factor as a distraction, and once he was knocked down he knew he was in for a tough fight. I think if they do a rematch it will be harder for Hurd to win versus Williams than it will be for Charlo to win versus Harrison.

I don't think the damage Hurd has taken is anywhere near the damage DeGale took yet either, but if he went to Middleweight and fought Jermall Charlo in another grueling fight Hurd could start declining quickly. It seems like he wants to stay at Super Welterweight and fight the rematch though if he wins obviously him versus the Harrison vs. Charlo rematch winner is back on so that would make sense for him.

Champion97's picture

Well for a start, his defence might not have been good against Trout or Lara, he has never had good defence, but against Williams, it seemed worse, and against Trout, he was pressuring him, making him work, being consistent, but against Williams, he wasn't doing that, he was waiting too long to get into the right range, and once he was on the inside, Williams got the better of him, I think, because Williams is a better inside fighter than be anticipated, but I also think he relied on Williams's own pace tiring him out and weakening him for the late rounds, which is a bad thing to do in boxing, and fighting with your face is another thing you can't do at this level. I agree, Harrison edged Charlo, no corruption, but Williams beat Hurd clearly, I thought it was a landslide and the cards were too narrow.

I think he shouldn't make the mistake Dogboe just made and push for the immediate rematch, because Harrison has the momentum, being desperate can be very bad for you, and you don't want to be in damaging fight after damaging fight, so maybe he should take a tune up next, go to the drawing board, because whether or not he expected Williams to be fairly easy, he needs to make a lot of adjustments, a very different game plan if he wants to beat Williams.

On my pound for pound list, I have 8 fighters who I would call great, Spence, Crawford, Lomachencko, Usyk, Canelo, Inoue, Fury, Davis, and of those 8, I only think 2 of them are devastating punchers, what do you think? Spence and Canelo have reputations as punchers, but I don't think they have much more raw power than some of the other 6.

Gold's picture

Williams fought a way different fight than Trout and Lara which meant Williams was able to expose holes in Hurd's defense that Trout and Lara couldn't. Williams is bigger, stronger, and more adapted to infighting than Trout and Lara who want to box off the back foot. Hurd wasn't able to pressure Williams because he couldn't box Williams in the center of the ring so he tried to infight on the ropes which didn't work either. It is just a big ask of Hurd to improve his skills enough to beat Williams in my opinion, he was beaten everywhere. Guys using their chins to block punches only lasts for so long, guys like Froch were able to do it for a while but he almost paid for it versus Groves. When guys who do that decline they decline hard because of the miles they take, Matthew Saad Muhammad is a good example of that.

I don't think he is as hopeless as Dogboe was in the rematch and I understand the reasons he shouldn't take the fight but it is his best money option. I don't think he can make the improvements necessary to win personally, but someone like Hurd who relies in part on their size will have a tough time going up in weight and not having as much of an advantage, so it is a balance of worrying about being weight drained and losing a significant size advantage.

I assume you would say Inoue and Davis are the devastating punchers? I don't have Davis on my top ten pound for pound but I would say those two are the devastating punchers out of the fighters you listed. Inoue and Wilder are the best punchers in boxing pound for pound by some margin for my money. Davis could be up there but I want to see him versus better opposition.

Champion97's picture

That all makes sense, but there was a lack of body work, too much waiting, there were times when he wouldn't let his hands go, needed to, wasn't being aggressive. Williams is good, better than we thought, but he isn't Mayweather, he isn't one of these fighters who is in against an opponent who looks so bad and can take 100% credit for making him look bad, and I just think it's a combination of Hurd over looking Williams, possibly being a bit drained, and Williams being underrated. Definitely, look at Sam Eggington, amongst good European level fighters, great British level fighters, you don't see defence worse than that, and the beatings he's just taken against Mwakinyo, Smith, he will be shot by the time he's 30 or even younger if he keeps taking beatings like that.

Is it definitely his best money option for the rest of his career?, because I'm not so sure, and the immediate rematch is bad for him, it would definitely be a risk, and I think when a fighter takes a fight only because of the money, he's lost before he's in the ring. I don't think he only relies on his size, he is a good pressure fighter, not the best at cutting off the ring, he isn't a great pressure fighter like Inoue or Canelo, but he's good, attacks the body well, but I think if he isn't having problems making 154, staying there isn't a bad idea.

Yes. Wilder is a pound for pound puncher, but so are Lemieux, Rungvasai, we know Lomachencko and Fury aren't pound for pound punchers but aren't non-punchers and have pound for pound skill. What I'm getting at, is that I think Spence and Canelo are overrated power punchers, Lamont Peterson and Mikey both say Lipinets hits harder than Spence, Algieri says Provodnikov hits harder, Bundu says Thurman hits harder, I am a fan of Spence, I'm not just saying he isn't a big puncher, I think Spence hits less hard than Thurman and maybe even Garcia, but he hits hard enough, has got great KOs because he has the ability to set up KOs, time them perfectly, has the accuracy as well, like Canelo. Canelo and Spence are probably better body punchers because they know you can do more damage to the body with less sheer power, and a problem a Matthysse, Lemieux, Wilder might have is that they are always headhunting, don't attack the body enough because they know they have that raw power. Davis and definitely Inoue seem to have that devastating power and are also good body punchers.

Gold's picture

I think the early knockdown and a fear of being countered are contributors to Hurd not pulling the trigger as much as he should have. Williams was too good technically on that night for it to come down to other factors like you said he should have won wider than the scorecards had it.

It is because it is guaranteed rather than based on future speculation. I'm sure Hurd believes he can win the rematch rather than just cashing out, wants to get revenge, etc, but it also is the best paying option. He doesn't just rely on his size but it is a significant advantage for him at Super Welterweight. For example, if Hurd were the same size as Lara he loses that fight conclusively in my opinion.

That's just the distinction between raw power and actually being able to use the power. I have seen people say that a trainer who held the mitts for Mike Tyson and Lucas Browne said Browne hits harder, but that's irrelevant in boxing because Lucas Browne couldn't land the shot Mike Tyson could. Lemieux and Matthysse to an extent have had the same problem of having difficulty setting up the punch at the highest level. I just question the impartiality of guys like Peterson and Mikey, to be honest. For Bundu, well he made it six with Spence and twelve with Thurman, and I don't think Spence's technique is really that superior if his power is supposedly worse. For me Thurman is an extremely overrated puncher, he was a very good puncher earlier in his career but look at his title reign, he has one stoppage and two knockdowns in five title fights which were versus washed up fighters. He is a boxer puncher and if he goes into the Pacquiao fight with the mentality he's going to power punch his way through Pacquiao he's likely not going to win. I don't like Thurman's mentality in general going into this fight. He's saying all kinds of weird things that fighters who are Pacquiao's age and not Thurman's say. Stuff like how he needs time off after the Pacquiao fight and won't fight again this year, how he won't fight Spence until 2020 because Spence needs to raise his profile when Spence is a bigger name than Thurman.

Champion97's picture

I think there is a difference between thinking you can win, and having the hunger, determination that you need to get revenge when you have been beat, and mentality is improtant for Hurd if he has a chance. The Williams fight won't be Hurd's last option for a payday, and there are fights for him at 160, but I agree his size and strength advantage, though not the only thing he has, is his best weapon, and yes, the Lara fight was very close, size is easily a big enough factor that you could argue it could have gone the other way.

I agree with some of that, and disagree with other parts.

Bundu has no reason to lie, Thurman has a mouth, if you are going to take a dig at anyone, it will be Thurman, I think nothing beats experience, and someone with first hand experience knows better than anyone, and that's why Bundu has the better idea than anyone else of how Spence vs Thurman would go, he said Spence was more precise than Thurman, but he also said Thurman hit harder, he got knocked out in 6 not because Spence hits harder but because Spence set him up, power, timing, accuracy, and Thurman didn't have the skill, ability to do that. Mikey has nothing against Spence, Algieri and Peterson as well, no reason to think they don't like Spence, but that's 4 opponents who have said Provodnikov, Lipinets, Thurman hit harder, so I will take the word of fighters who have been in the ring against the fighters we are talking about.

Holding the mitts up is not a good way of telling if someone has power, agree with that, but fighting is different, so that trainer can't be taken as seriously as fighters who have fought Thurman and Spence. Roach said Fury hits harder than Wilder, which just shows how inconclusive it is. I don't agree on Thurman's power because Porter, Garcia have granite chins, Porter said he never faced a puncher like Thurman, you should read what Bundu says about his power, but he doesn't set his shots up as well as Spence or Crawford, he isn't a relentless fighter who keeps the pressure on, he also doesn't make his opponent walk into shots, but I think for sheer power, he hits almost as hard as people think, but maybe nkt quite as hard, because whatever possible explanations there are, facts are, Thurman hasn't knocked anyone out since 2015, and one KO in 5 fights, just like you said. I think Spence's technical skill is extremely underrated, and I think he proved he has great technical skill against Mikey.

For Thurman's mentality, disagree about the activity, 2 fights a year is the right amount at this level, but I saw that earlier about delaying the Spence fight even more, and I agree with you, that's a joke, he doesn't want Spence. I don't like Thurman's mentality either, one minute talking like an old fighter, next minute, he's going to kick the shit out of Pacquiao.

Gold's picture

The only fight for him at Middleweight at PBC is versus Jermall Charlo and he may need to take an interim fight first. If he stays at Super Welterweight he can fight the immediate rematch versus Williams and if he wins he can face Jermell Charlo. Moving up isn't a terrible option but I see why he wants to stay at Super Welterweight.

All I will say about this kind of stuff is read Ring Magazine's "Best I Ever Faced" series. You'll find that quite a few boxers have big egos and won't give credit to opponents that beat them the worst as being their best opponents and instead give credit to opponents they beat or fought closely as being their best opponents. For me, it is impossible to take a boxers word on subjects like that because of the aforementioned biases.

His first fight this year was a tune-up and he's fighting Pacquiao in July. He's in what should theoretically be the prime of his career, so he should stay open to an opportunity if it comes up late in the year because this is when he can optimize the amount of money he's making instead of saying he's "gotta relax".

Champion97's picture

I believe he said last year that he would move up in 2019 or 2020, so based on that, Hurd moving to 160 is a question of when, not if. There is also Derevyanchenko, Korobov, not saying he has a lot of great options, and definitely short term, his best financial option is the rematch, but there are fights for him at 160.

I understand that you can't always take what fighters say seriously, Saunders knew Spike wouldn't knock Eubank out (that's what he said), Froch said Groves would get knocked out by Abraham and Dirrell, but Paul Smith had a great shot against Abraham. That is a possibility, but I just don't buy that, that's 4 fighters, I just don't buy that they are protecting their ego, and at the very least, whether you believe them or not, you have to take what fighters say into consideration. Agree to disagree I suppose.

It was supposed to be, but that wasn't just a tune up, that was a tough fight, that beating he took against Lopez, went 12 rounds, that was a tough fight, that's half a year's work for a world champion for sure, and the Pacquiao fight is a big fight, so I think he is right to hold off until next year, as long as he fights early next year, March at the latest, I won't criticise his activity. I'm not convinced Thurman wants to fight Spence, I don't think he beats Porter or Garcia now, nevermind Spence, and I would not be surprised if Pacquiao beat him, and proved me wrong for the third time on the trot, but I think Thurman has the beating of Pacquiao, and if he does, like him or not, he is back in the mix.

Gold's picture

True, but Derevyanchenko and Korobov in non-title fights likely aren't as interesting for Hurd as the Williams rematch with the potential of fighting Jermell Charlo. It will be a year or more until a title gets freed up at Middleweight if it does at all. It is just a bad political situation at Middleweight for PBC fighters at the moment.

Yeah, this is a point where we will have to agree to disagree. I think there is sometimes things that can be taken from fighters of course but for me, it is hard to make definitive statements when biases come into play.

I don't know, I don't think Thurman took a beating. He was one or two punches away from being stopped in I think the seventh but the majority of the fight he controlled without much issue and didn't get too banged up. What I mean is that he should be open for an opportunity with PBC's Welterweight stable instead of saying he has to "relax" for six months. I think Thurman will win, looking at it historically it is just too difficult to favor Pacquiao but it is difficult to pick a winner. If Thurman wins I really believe he is going to milk the title for over a year before he fights Spence if he ever does. He'll fight a voluntary and the winner of Mikey Garcia vs. Danny Garcia before he fights Spence if he ever does.

Champion97's picture

That all makes sense in terms of the near future, but Hurd is not an old fighter who needs one big payout, he should have a good few years left, the fights I suggested aren't bad fights for the near future, it is a bad political situation at Middleweight for PBC fighters at the moment, but in one year, two, it might be a lot better and a different weight class will have those issues.

I'm not disputing what you say on the bias front, that's why I mentioned Froch and Saunders, I just think the explanation about egos was a bit of a stretch, and if a most likely impartial fighter like Bundu, Algieri, says something when comparing opponents, it should be taken a lot more seriously than anything anyone else says, even a coach who has worked with both fighters, and one thing is for sure, these guys have the potential ability to have a better idea than anyone else, on how the fighters compare.

He did, I mean, that was a 3 minute beating, he almost got stopped, that was a lot of damage, if he had taken that for 12 rounds or even 9 rounds, could have ruined his career, he was out on his feet, he showed a lot of heart, fitness to get through that. Thurman took a lot of damage against Lopez, interestingly, maybe more damage than Pacquiao has taken in a fight since the Marquez KO, but I'm not implying Thurman has more miles than Pacquiao, I'm just saying, after that, 2 fights is plenty, there is a balance fighters have to find between a Gary Russell Jr who fights once a year, and a Jaime Munguia, Dmitry Bivol, Tevin Farmer, who fight too often.

I agree on that, he won't go straight into another tough fight, he will enjoy the Pacquiao win and take a tune up next, but I think not only that, and he will also try to build up a Porter or Garcia rematch for next year, which isn't bad, but he won't fight Spence, because maybe he just doesn't believe he can win, and you can't blame a fighter for ducking when they are not confident they can win.

Gold's picture

Right, but he should maximize what he has currently available. Nothing is guaranteed in boxing. With Canelo at Middleweight it is unlikely more than one title will be freed up at any time, he is the big ticket and sanctioning bodies are out to make money.

I don't know if they are impartial or not so if you want to take their word for it then that's your prerogative.

I think the history of boxing has shown it is worse to get in a war than to get dropped once or nearly stopped and win the rest of his fight. Thurman hasn't taken much damage in his career, it's injuries and will that are the question. Fighting twice a year is a more recent invention because of promotional budgets and schedules. For most fighters twice a year is fine but Thurman needs to maximize the opportunities he has because I doubt he'll be fighting for more than two more years. My main problem is that he says he needs to relax instead of keeping his possibilities open, I'm not saying he should fight three times this year but when he has limited time left in the sport and is trying to get his career back on track he should consider it.

He should take the blame if it holds up Spence fighting for the WBA title and/or holds up Crawford vs. Spence.

Champion97's picture

Ideally yes, but not if it could jeopardise future big money fights, the Williams rematch is a good fight financially, but it is not the opportunity of a lifetime. Good point, but will Canelo remain at 160?, and how likely is he to lose a belt over taking a better fight over a mandatory? With Hurd, I think is depends on his mentality towards the rematch, bit he shouldn't take it just because of the money, I agree a rematch wouldn't go as badly for him as Dogboe against Navarrete, but he did lose to Williams every bit as wide as Dogboe lost to Navarrete. For what it is worth, I think the rematch will happen, I just don't know if it is Hurd's wisest option, but it is still a good fight.

When there is no reason to think they aren't impartial, no need not to take their word, that's the way I see it, and because I gave you 4 examples, I think we can safely say that Thurman hits harder than Spence, you disagree, fair enough, but although their judgement can be clouded, fighters with first hand experience who has fought the two fighters we are talking about, they have the potential to answer questions we can't answer, that is for sure.

I'm not saying it is worse than a war, I'm saying the damage he took, even just one round, puts damage on the clock, even though a round after round beating would have been worse, it was still a damaging fight, and in that long round, he did take a beating, the sort of round you don't want to have too many of, and Thurman took more damage against Lopez than Pacquiao has taken since the Marquez KO, if you agree on the Horn fight not being as damaging. What I take from Thurman taking damage against Lopez, is that he needs the 6 months between fights.

It is also because camps are more advanced, fights are more individual, all the top fighters fight twice a year, no reason for Thurman to fight more often than that unless one is a complete mismatch and even then only possibly. We've seen the 3 fighters I gave examples of, not do great in their last fights, I believe, because they didn't have enough time preparing for that specific opponent, maybe didn't rest enough. I understand his future is bleak because he is likely to get injured, age won't help that, but he is fighting Pacquiao, and realistically, two hard fights, and then another camp, another fight in the same hear just seems unwise, making money or not. He should not fight this year after Pacquiao, but he should be back early nexy year, ideally February or even January, and he shouldn't have the mentality that the Pacquiao win will give him a pass to call himself the best and take it easy for a year or two, that I will say.

I agree, he has made no effort to make the Spence fight, I don't think he is confident he wins, he shouldn't still be the WBA champion, and he is definitely the one who is holding up the Spence fight.

Champion97's picture

Unlikely he could beat Fury, agree on that, but he is underrated, has been impressive in his last 3 fights.

petieroach's picture

hey is McCaskill vs Sanchez up? I didn't see it and it was a great part of this card

Champion97's picture

I deleted it because nobody had scored it, I could add it again, but it isn't 5he sort of fight people will revisit, so I thought may as well delete it.

petieroach's picture

yea it doesnt matter, forget it

just was wondering